• Running under Windows 10 slowness

    From Nightfox@1:103/705 to All on Thu Dec 21 18:57:35 2017
    I had been running my BBS in a Windows XP VM for quite a while, but recently I've been experimenting with a Windows 10 (32-bit) VM for my BBS. I have it running in Windows 10 now, and I've noticed it seems somewhat slower than it was with XP (for instance, a message newscan seems to take more time). The Win10 OS overall seems somewhat slower (sometimes a program or a Control Panel applet takes a little more time to appear). I've disabled some background apps and services that I don't need and made some tweaks (such as disabling visual effects in the UI, etc.), which helped a bit, but it still seems somewhat slower than XP was. The hardware requirements for Win10 32-bit include 1GB of RAM, but I've given the VM 3GB of RAM, which I'd hope should be plenty for the OS and running Synchronet.

    Has anyone else been running their Synchronet BBS in Win10?

    Nightfox

    ---
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  • From DesotoFireflite@1:103/705 to Nightfox on Fri Dec 22 06:29:08 2017
    Re: Running under Windows 10 slowness
    By: Nightfox to All on Thu Dec 21 2017 06:57 pm

    Has anyone else been running their Synchronet BBS in Win10?

    I run both bbs's and my gameserver all on windows 10 32 bit, and it's very fast. It's stand alone, not a vm. It may be the vm causing your slow down.

    SysOp: C.G. Learn, AKA: DesotoFireflite
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  • From Lord Time@1:103/705 to Nightfox on Fri Dec 22 07:40:27 2017
    I had been running my BBS in a Windows XP VM for quite a while, but recently I've been experimenting with a Windows 10 (32-bit) VM for my BBS. I have it running in Windows 10 now, and I've noticed it seems somewhat slower than it was with XP (for instance, a message newscan seems to take more time). The Win10 OS overall seems somewhat slower (sometimes a program or a Control Panel applet takes a little more time to appear). I've disabled some background apps and services that I don't need and made some tweaks (such as disabling visual effects in the UI, etc.), which helped a bit, but it still seems somewhat slower than XP was. The hardware requirements for Win10 32-bit include 1GB of RAM, but I've given the VM 3GB of RAM, which I'd hope should be plenty for the OS and running Synchronet.

    Has anyone else been running their Synchronet BBS in Win10?

    as of 12/18/17 running win. 10 pro. 64 bit (16 gb). with 3 vm. (win. 7 home
    32 bit. - bbs 4 gb, debian 9.? 64 bit. with 2096 mb - about to be another bbs (#2) building it up, windows server 2003 32 bit, 512 mb. a server, not public and not ready, but online) and having no problems


    ---

    Rob Starr
    Lord Time SysOp of
    Time Warp of the Future BBS
    Telnet://Time.Darktech.Org:24 or
    Telnet://Time.Synchro.Net:24 (qwk or ftn & e-mail)
    ICQ # 11868133 or # 70398519 Jabber : lordtime2000@gmail.com
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    ---
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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@1:103/705 to Nightfox on Fri Dec 22 09:22:49 2017
    Re: Running under Windows 10 slowness
    By: Nightfox to All on Thu Dec 21 2017 06:57 pm

    Has anyone else been running their Synchronet BBS in Win10?

    Nope, I'm a big fan of MicroXP for VM use; I don't run much on the BBS except for the BBS, utilities, WinAmp and ShoutCast, and sticking to a cut-down version of XP reminds me to keep the VM lean.

    Without IE and Outlook Express and all the other Windows apps taken out, I'm hoping that the exploit footprint is smaller.

    ---
    * Synchronet * realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org
    * Origin: Vertrauen - [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net (1:103/705)
  • From Nightfox@1:103/705 to DesotoFireflite on Fri Dec 22 11:49:30 2017
    Re: Running under Windows 10 slowness
    By: DesotoFireflite to Nightfox on Fri Dec 22 2017 06:29 am

    I run both bbs's and my gameserver all on windows 10 32 bit, and it's very fast. It's stand alone, not a vm. It may be the vm causing your slow down.

    Perhaps, though these days I wouldn't think the VM would slow it down too much. The VM has a virtual Intel CPU, and the host machine is Intel - My understanding is that it doesn't actually need to emulate the processor, it can actually use the host processor more directly.

    Nightfox

    ---
    * Synchronet * Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
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  • From Nightfox@1:103/705 to Lord Time on Fri Dec 22 11:50:24 2017
    Re: Re: Running under Windows 10 slowness
    By: Lord Time to Nightfox on Fri Dec 22 2017 07:40 am

    as of 12/18/17 running win. 10 pro. 64 bit (16 gb). with 3 vm. (win. 7 home 32 bit. - bbs 4 gb, debian 9.? 64 bit. with 2096 mb - about to be another bbs (#2) building it up, windows server 2003 32 bit, 512 mb. a server, not public and not ready, but online) and having no problems

    But is your BBS running in Windows 10 or one of those VMs?

    Nightfox

    ---
    * Synchronet * Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@1:103/705 to Nightfox on Fri Dec 22 13:57:07 2017
    Re: Running under Windows 10 slowness
    By: Nightfox to DesotoFireflite on Fri Dec 22 2017 11:49 am

    Perhaps, though these days I wouldn't think the VM would slow it down too much. The VM has a virtual Intel CPU, and the host machine is Intel - My understanding is that it doesn't actually need to emulate the processor, it can actually use the host processor more directly.

    More likely, slowdowns are caused by running emulated hardware drivers instead of the VM-Friendly ones. VMWare, for example, comes with VMWare tools that installs optimized drivers and enables things like drag and drop, resizable guest windows, etc. Apparently, there's a bit of a speed hit when using a bare metal driver in a VM compared to the VM-specific drivers.

    ---
    * Synchronet * realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org
    * Origin: Vertrauen - [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net (1:103/705)
  • From Lord Time@1:103/705 to Nightfox on Fri Dec 22 15:35:45 2017
    Re: Re: Running under Windows 10 slowness
    By: Lord Time to Nightfox on Fri Dec 22 2017 07:40 am

    as of 12/18/17 running win. 10 pro. 64 bit (16 gb). with 3 vm. (win. 7 home 32 bit. - bbs 4 gb, debian 9.? 64 bit. with 2096 mb - about to be another bbs (#2) building it up, windows server 2003 32 bit, 512 mb. a server, not public and not ready, but online) and having no problems

    But is your BBS running in Windows 10 or one of those VMs?

    win. 10 is the main computer os, and the bbs is running win. 7 as a vm.


    ---

    Rob Starr
    Lord Time SysOp of
    Time Warp of the Future BBS
    Telnet://Time.Darktech.Org:24 or
    Telnet://Time.Synchro.Net:24 (qwk or ftn & e-mail)
    ICQ # 11868133 or # 70398519 Jabber : lordtime2000@gmail.com
    Astra : lord_time
    X-Box : Lord Time 2000 oovoo : lordtime2000 Skype : lordtime@tds.net
    ---
    * Synchronet * Time Warp of the Future BBS - Home of League 10 IBBS Games
    * Origin: Vertrauen - [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net (1:103/705)
  • From Digital Man@1:103/705 to Nightfox on Fri Dec 22 16:34:13 2017
    Re: Running under Windows 10 slowness
    By: Nightfox to DesotoFireflite on Fri Dec 22 2017 11:49 am

    Re: Running under Windows 10 slowness
    By: DesotoFireflite to Nightfox on Fri Dec 22 2017 06:29 am

    I run both bbs's and my gameserver all on windows 10 32 bit, and it's very fast. It's stand alone, not a vm. It may be the vm causing your slow down.

    Perhaps, though these days I wouldn't think the VM would slow it down too much. The VM has a virtual Intel CPU, and the host machine is Intel - My understanding is that it doesn't actually need to emulate the processor, it can actually use the host processor more directly.

    There's virtualization acceleration in modern hardware (processors, network and video controllers, etc.), but the system is still being "emulated" or virtualized. There is definitely, absolutely, a performance hit although many engineers and companies are working hard to minimize that hit every day.

    digital man

    Synchronet "Real Fact" #36:
    Synchronet's Windows DLLs are built with Microsoft Visual Studio/C++.
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    * Origin: Vertrauen - [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net (1:103/705)
  • From Nightfox@1:103/705 to poindexter FORTRAN on Fri Dec 22 16:12:02 2017
    Re: Running under Windows 10 slowness
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Nightfox on Fri Dec 22 2017 01:57 pm

    More likely, slowdowns are caused by running emulated hardware drivers instead of the VM-Friendly ones. VMWare, for example, comes with VMWare tools that installs optimized drivers and enables things like drag and drop, resizable guest windows, etc. Apparently, there's a bit of a speed hit when using a bare metal driver in a VM compared to the VM-specific drivers.

    I'm using VirtualBox, and I have the VirtualBox guest OS drivers installed already.

    Nightfox

    ---
    * Synchronet * Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
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  • From DesotoFireflite@1:103/705 to Nightfox on Sat Dec 23 06:46:44 2017
    Re: Running under Windows 10 slowness
    By: Nightfox to DesotoFireflite on Fri Dec 22 2017 11:49 am

    I run both bbs's and my gameserver all on windows 10 32 bit, and
    it's very fast. It's stand alone, not a vm. It may be the vm causing
    your slow down.

    Perhaps, though these days I wouldn't think the VM would slow it down too much. The VM has a virtual Intel CPU, and the host machine is Intel - My understanding is that it doesn't actually need to emulate the processor, it can actually use the host processor more directly.

    I don't do the VM route, but a friend of mine in California that runs a bbs does, and he had problems with win 10 vm inside a windows 10 machine, and decided to swithch back to a win 7 vm. Win 10 is so bloated with extras, it may be causing issues. I've turned off most of the extra stuff in mine.

    SysOp: C.G. Learn, AKA: DesotoFireflite
    Valhalla Home Services! - (Synchronet) - bbs.valhallabbs.com
    Valhalla II! - (GAP) - bbs.valhallabbs.com:24
    A Gamers Paradise - Over 150 Registered Online Game Doors!

    Play Trade Wars Between 10 Other BBS's On Valhalla's Trade Wars Game Server!

    Featuring Legion, A New RPG, Available On Both Systems!

    --- Don't eat the yellow snow!
    * Synchronet * Valhalla Home Services * USA * http://valhalla.synchro.net
    * Origin: Vertrauen - [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net (1:103/705)
  • From DesotoFireflite@1:103/705 to Nightfox on Sat Dec 23 06:51:15 2017
    Re: Running under Windows 10 slowness
    By: Nightfox to DesotoFireflite on Fri Dec 22 2017 11:49 am

    I run both bbs's and my gameserver all on windows 10 32 bit, and
    it's very fast. It's stand alone, not a vm. It may be the vm causing
    your slow down.

    Perhaps, though these days I wouldn't think the VM would slow it down too much. The VM has a virtual Intel CPU, and the host machine is Intel - My understanding is that it doesn't actually need to emulate the processor, it can actually use the host processor more directly.

    In addition to my last note, I do run a vm on my macbook, and it's a windows 10 vm. The vm is by paraells, but it is very slow compared to the the win 7 vm I had as a vm. I think my problem however is due to that I've reached the limits of the older processor. I'm going back to win 7 on my macbook.

    SysOp: C.G. Learn, AKA: DesotoFireflite
    Valhalla Home Services! - (Synchronet) - bbs.valhallabbs.com
    Valhalla II! - (GAP) - bbs.valhallabbs.com:24
    A Gamers Paradise - Over 150 Registered Online Game Doors!

    Play Trade Wars Between 10 Other BBS's On Valhalla's Trade Wars Game Server!

    Featuring Legion, A New RPG, Available On Both Systems!

    --- A true friend knows who you are... But likes you anyway.
    * Synchronet * Valhalla Home Services * USA * http://valhalla.synchro.net
    * Origin: Vertrauen - [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net (1:103/705)
  • From Nightfox@1:103/705 to DesotoFireflite on Sat Dec 23 11:57:42 2017
    Re: Running under Windows 10 slowness
    By: DesotoFireflite to Nightfox on Sat Dec 23 2017 06:46 am

    I don't do the VM route, but a friend of mine in California that runs a bbs does, and he had problems with win 10 vm inside a windows 10 machine, and decided to swithch back to a win 7 vm. Win 10 is so bloated with extras, it may be causing issues. I've turned off most of the extra stuff in mine.

    I didn't think of Windows 10 as being very bloated.. Windows 10 is a continuation of Windows 8.x, and (I thought) was aimed at performing well on either a PC or tablet. I thought Microsoft had leaned Windows down a bit starting with 8.x.

    Nightfox

    ---
    * Synchronet * Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
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  • From Nightfox@1:103/705 to DesotoFireflite on Sat Dec 23 12:00:02 2017
    Re: Running under Windows 10 slowness
    By: DesotoFireflite to Nightfox on Sat Dec 23 2017 06:51 am

    In addition to my last note, I do run a vm on my macbook, and it's a windows 10 vm. The vm is by paraells, but it is very slow compared to the the win 7 vm I had as a vm. I think my problem however is due to that I've reached the limits of the older processor. I'm going back to win 7 on my macbook.

    I suppose I might have to try that if my Win10 VM ends up being too slow. I wanted to go with a newer version of Windows though, since I think Windows 7 has reached the end of its support life from Microsoft.

    Nightfox

    ---
    * Synchronet * Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
    * Origin: Vertrauen - [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net (1:103/705)
  • From Lord Time@1:103/705 to Nightfox on Sat Dec 23 15:58:45 2017
    In addition to my last note, I do run a vm on my macbook, and it's a windows 10 vm. The vm is by paraells, but it is very slow compared to the the win 7 vm I had as a vm. I think my problem however is due to that I've reached the limits of the older processor. I'm going back to win 7 on my macbook.

    I suppose I might have to try that if my Win10 VM ends up being too slow. I wanted to go with a newer version of Windows though, since I think Windows 7 has reached the end of its support life from Microsoft.

    xp & vista have no windows updates anymore, win. 7 does still have updates


    ---

    Rob Starr
    Lord Time SysOp of
    Time Warp of the Future BBS
    Telnet://Time.Darktech.Org:24 or
    Telnet://Time.Synchro.Net:24 (qwk or ftn & e-mail)
    ICQ # 11868133 or # 70398519 Jabber : lordtime2000@gmail.com
    Astra : lord_time
    X-Box : Lord Time 2000 oovoo : lordtime2000 Skype : lordtime@tds.net
    ---
    * Synchronet * Time Warp of the Future BBS - Home of League 10 IBBS Games
    * Origin: Vertrauen - [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net (1:103/705)
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@1:103/705 to Nightfox on Wed Dec 27 08:26:04 2017
    Re: Running under Windows 10 slowness
    By: Nightfox to DesotoFireflite on Sat Dec 23 2017 11:57 am

    I didn't think of Windows 10 as being very bloated.. Windows 10 is a continuation of Windows 8.x, and (I thought) was aimed at performing well on either a PC or tablet. I thought Microsoft had leaned Windows down a bit starting with 8.x.

    They did. 10 runs much better than 8 did on the same hardware here.

    ---
    * Synchronet * realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org
    * Origin: Vertrauen - [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net (1:103/705)